Kyma Forum
  Confabulation
  Molecules of air

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Molecules of air
dickow
Member
posted 25 April 2005 18:26         Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I was just wondering...suddenly... about the 'real' behavior (if there is such a thing) of air molecules in the presence of sound wave energy.

Given an increase of amplitude, does an individual molecule of air in the acoustic medium actually traverse more SPACE, or does it simply have more FORCE in the form of pressure or something? In other words, does a molecule, perhaps, NOT actually traverse more space, but rather simply have more energy in the form of SPEED, say?) relative to a nearby molecule? Does it matter? Is there a difference?

What does AMPLITUDE really represent, in other words... energy in the form of speed, or is it spatial displacement, of the air molecules?

What are we actually hearing occur in a LOUDER sound in terms of the behavior of individual molecules of air? Is there any way to know this? Am I ignorant of some basic physical facts?

Is this a dumb question?

Bob Dickow

IP: Logged

pete
Member
posted 26 April 2005 06:06         Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi bob

The answer (as I believe it) is both speed and pressure will increase, as the two are directly related. A louder volume will make the speed, the distance traveled and the pressure of the molecules all greater. The speed of a molecule determines how far it can travel into its near by molecules and how much sucsess it will have in squashing them together. The amount of squash of these molecules determine how fast they can launch other molecules. The energy keeps getting transformed from kynetic (speed)energy into potantial (pressure) energy and back again. Its difficult to measure as it is happening in a streem and many different energy transformations are happening at the same time, but all the pressure energy was created by speed energy and all the speed energy was created by presure energy (apart from the speaker movement that created all the energy in the first place). So apart from frictional losses and after the speaker has stopped generating additional energy the total speed and pressure energy added together will remain the same.

You can show this idea using wave forms in kyma and viewing them on the osciliscope . If we assume that a molecule is moving back and forth as a sine wave, then the greater pressure energy will be at the two peeks. To show it's energy we need to multiply it by it's self to get the square of the pressure. The speed of the same molecule will be the original positional sine wave shifted by 90 degs. If we take that 90 deg shifted sinewave and multiply it by it's self, we get a waveform that represents the kynetic energy. If we add this to the other squared wave form we get an output that is a constant DC. The energy may be transforming but there is no gain or loss.

Hope this makes sense

Pete

IP: Logged

SSC
Administrator
posted 26 April 2005 14:35         Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My understanding is that: amplitude corresponds to displacement. Thus, a bigger amplitude would correspond to a larger displacement of air molecules (though *never* a jet of air that moves a single molecule all the way from the speaker cone to your ear! Unless you are talking about an aerodynamic jet of air .

(I really like Pete's description of how the amplitude and the velocity are periodically trading off with each other--like the difference between potential and kinetic energy. An air molecule moves until it bumps into another air molecule, transferring its energy to the neighbor, which then moves until it runs into *its* neighbor, etc.)

Hoping that one of the physicists on this forum will correct any inaccuracies or sloppy terminology I may have inadvertently introduced(!)

IP: Logged

Bill Meadows
Member
posted 27 April 2005 00:31         Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Right, amplitude is displacement.

When you turn up your amplifier, your speaker cone moves further, thus displacing the air molecules more.

Of course for a given frequency, the time it takes for the cone to go from one position to another is constant. Thus, the cone is moving faster (linearly) at higher amplitude. So the two phenomena are related.

And as already mentioned, individual air molecules just go back and forth, they don't fly across the room as a result of the acoustical signal.

IP: Logged

pete
Member
posted 27 April 2005 04:48         Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just to add to what Bill said.

The speed the molecules move at is faster at higher frequencies and higher volumes. If the molecules did fly across the room as a result of the acoustical signal, then the speed of sound would be faster for higher frequencies and higher volumes, which it isn't. This is how the speed of sound can be a constant, even though the speed of the molecules movements can be very different.

IP: Logged

All times are CT (US)

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply

Contact Us | Symbolic Sound Home

This forum is provided solely for the support and edification of the customers of Symbolic Sound Corporation.


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.45c