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 Sound sounds different in Timeline
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| Author | Topic: Sound sounds different in Timeline | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 20 April 2008 02:30
 
Try the "eraser" Sound by itself and in the Timeline to hear the difference. Why is this happening? IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 22 April 2008 19:24
SSC - got any ideas about this? I really need it to work. (I need it to sound like the Sound itself sounds, not like the Sound sounds when it is in the Timeline.) IP: Logged | |
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bluefire Member |
posted 22 April 2008 23:34
Would timeline and not-timeline use different output routes? IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 23 April 2008 08:29
No. The difference in sound seems somehow related to the behavior of the Amplitude Follower in the Sound. When played by itself, you can smoothly scan through the waveform with the Wacom Pen. When played in the Timeline, the scanning is jumpy and jerky, almost like the time constant has changed. IP: Logged | |
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SSC Administrator |
posted 24 April 2008 10:23
Hi Bill, I've been trying to replicate the behavior here, but on my setup !KeyTimbre seems to be the same inside and outside the Timeline, so there must be something else going on. Is it possible that your computer went to sleep and you woke it up between the time when you tried it outside the Timeline and the time you tried it inside the Timeline? I've noticed that, if the computer goes to sleep the Wacom can go into a mode where it outputs 0 on every other value (the only way around it seems to be to reboot). Have you tried using !PenY in place of !KeyTimbre (and using the pointed side of the Pen) to see whether this behaves any differently? If it works with PenY, then there might be something going on with the 'MIDI channel' of the Pen. Thanks. IP: Logged | |
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robertjarvis Member |
posted 24 April 2008 13:48
I also get the same effect as described by Bill. It is most noticeable when you scrub from top to bottom of the Wacom tablet slowly, although I don't think that it is related to the actual speed of the pen. I also tried it with the 'aou' sample, and with this it is really clear. I am using the latest version of Kyma with a MacBook. [This message has been edited by robertjarvis (edited 24 April 2008).] IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 25 April 2008 01:10
Thanks for verifying this Robert. I can go back and forth from Sound to Timeline and the behavior is different. The computer isn't sleeping in between. [This message has been edited by Bill Meadows (edited 25 April 2008).] IP: Logged | |
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SSC Administrator |
posted 25 April 2008 14:48
Robert & Bill--Is either of you using the AV/C firmware on the Flame? Also, has either of you had a chance to try it with !PenY in place of !KeyTimbre? Just trying to gather more info on why this might behave differently. IP: Logged | |
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robertjarvis Member |
posted 28 April 2008 08:31
As far as I know, I am not using the AV/C firmware on the Flame. When I replace !KeyTimbre with !PenY the Sound doesn't appear to work at all. Specifically, I do this by replacing the value "!KeyTimbre" with "!PenY" in the 'Constant' Sound. When I control-play to run the Sound my VCS shows the top bit of a fader entitled PenY. If I change the layout so that I can see the number values then I can see them changing when I move the Wacom Pen, but I hear no audio. Is this helpful?
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 30 April 2008 22:27
quote: Finally got back to the project and tried !PenY instead of !KeyTimbre. The results are the same - it works when compiled by itself, but it behaves differently when compiled in a Timeline. I'm not using the AV/C firmware. IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 01 May 2008 08:15
I have found that it helps if I add smoothing to the !KeyTimbre message when compiling in the Timeline. This doesn't completely cure the problem (it actually creates some other issues) but it at least gets the sound closer to the non-Timeline version of the Sound. This seems to indicate that the problem stems from the rate at which the !KeyTimbre (or !PenY, I tried both) messages get read into the Sound in the Timeline. IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 01 May 2008 22:25
The problem is clearly related to the Pen messages. Run this Timeline and in the VCS, assign a MIDI controller to !value. You will get smooth scrubbing through the file when you move the control. Now change the assignment to !PenY and listen to it - it has a motorboat-like fluttering to it. If you pull the Sound out of the Timeline and use !PenY, it works smoothly like the MIDI controller did. I need this Sound to sound smoothly in the Timeline with the pen. How can I fix this? IP: Logged | |
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SSC Administrator |
posted 01 May 2008 22:59
Yes, it appears that the Timeline is slowing down the update rate of the Pen controls. One thing you could try for now is to make !TimeConstant a variable and adjust it upwards until you smooth out the "granular effect". I was able to get a pretty smooth sound using a TimeConstant of 0.3 s. IP: Logged | |
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Bill Meadows Member |
posted 02 May 2008 09:02
My best result so far is to cascade two Amplitude Followers, the first one with TC=50ms, the second one with TC=100ms. This works well enough for me now. It's still odd that the MIDI control works fine in both cases but the pen doesn't. IP: Logged | |
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garth paine Member |
posted 04 May 2008 17:33
I have noticed previously that the Timeline appears to slow down the update rate of the Pen controls - this has been a problem when doing a piece that uses fast changes of pen position for glitchy sounds in performance - these become more interpolated and less hard edged. Cheers, Garth IP: Logged |
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